How are the Sun and Moon dates Thelemic at all?

By convention. Thelema is a solar cult, after all, so measuring the date by the position of the Sun appears appropriate.

OK that is one thing, but astrologically measuring it isn’t very scientific.

It’s as “scientific” as measuring it any other way; it’s just a different point of reference and a different scale.

And the moon?

Whilst we can measure the degree of the zodiac with great accuracy, confining ourselves to integers (instead of saying ‘1.425643 degrees of Libra,’ for instance) only gives us a precision of approximately one day. Since the Moon moves through one degree approximately every two hours, we get some added precision by referencing that too. That being said, it’s still not particularly precise, and the position of the Moon in the zodiac is nowhere near as important as the position of the Sun is.

On the other hand, “For he is ever a sun, and she a moon,” so people like stating the time in terms of them both; thinking of the time in terms of the Sun and the Moon forces one to pay attention to them. You can read my latest essay, which will be out in a couple hours or so, to understand better the importance of the Sun in particular to Thelema.

Not only this but it differs where you are in the world.

No it doesn’t. The position of the centre of the Earth in relation to the Sun is wholly independent of where you happen to be situated on the surface of it, as is the position of the centre of the Moon.

This is what happens when you pretend to have done your homework, but in fact have not; you make fundamental errors such as this one which leave you looking rather silly.

Also, are you using tropical or sidereal, etc.?

Tropical, obviously, since the Thelemic date is measured with reference to the solar cycle, as anybody who is familiar with Thelemic dates would know, and as anybody who wasn’t familiar with them would be able to easily guess based on the highly numerous references to the “equinox” throughout Thelemic literature.

There are many different ways of measuring.

Yes, but only one way of measuring it this way. You may as well argue against the regular way of measuring dates on the grounds that some cultures don’t measure year one from the same point that we do, or because the Russian church doesn’t accept Gregorian calendar reform.

The fact that you think this is just as scientific is questionable…

I think it is more questionable that you appear to be once more attempting to lay down the law on something that you clearly know very little about to someone who clearly does know about it. I predicted that you would begin to look foolish if you persisted in doing this, and that’s exactly what’s happening now.

What you ought to start doing is understanding the subject at hand before you start trying to tell other people they’re wrong about it. Otherwise, you’re going to start getting a reputation as an obnoxious and clueless little twit. You’ve only relatively recently started doing this, so whatever happened that made you think you made a certain amount of progress, go back and reconsider that conclusion, because you’re mistaken about it.

The moon in fact is different from one state to another at any one time, let alone across the world.

“The moon in fact is different”? Really? It’s a different moon? Each state has its own moon, now? See, for all your talk about being “scientific,” your use of language is incredibly sloppy, and this is why you have immense difficulty conducting any kind of meaningful technical debate.

The apparent position of the Moon in the sky differs, you dolt, but although in sidereal astrology it’s apparent zodiacal position can differ by a degree or two across the U.S., when using tropical astrology it does not, since its position isn’t measured against the background of the constellations. The centres of the various planets are used for the angular calculations of tropical astrology.

The Sun is not measured from the center of the Earth, nor is the Moon.

And if I’d mentioned anything at all about “measuring the Sun,” you’d have a point. However, since you’re pulling your regular trick of pretending I said the things that you’d wished I said, this is wholly irrelevant.

Are you aware there is something called Sidereal astrology? Are you aware the dates are different between sidereal and tropical?

Yes, I am, and as I’m now telling you for the second time in as many posts, Thelemic dates are not based on sidereal measurements, but on the solar cycle, starting and ending on the vernal equinox. Your comprehension skills are appalling. Apparently not only is your usage of language incredibly sloppy, but your understanding of it is, also. This is because you spend more time paying attention to what’s in your head than you do paying attention to what’s actually in front of you.

Apparently YOU arent familiar…

The irony is simply astounding, here. Go actually learn something about astrology, insteading of misquoting shit you misunderstood from Wikipedia. I’ve just put up two applications on this site which calculate the zodiacal positions of the Sun and the Moon at any given time, and in order to do this I obviously have to know how to calculate those positions. The fact that, given this knowledge, it would even enter your head to consider that I’m “not familiar” with those calculations is hilarious, and highly revealing of the sloppiness by which your mind works when you allow your ego to get the better of you, which appears to be most of the time, lately.

Wake up, and pay attention. You’re making yourself look like a prize idiot, as I predicted. You are suffering from a classic case of ego-inflation. Since 90% of what you know about Thelema has come from me, and I stress heavily the dangers of paying attention to the pictures in your head, you’d be able to see this if you took a step back, and I suggest you make a concerted effort to do so. You have a lot of work to do.

Seriously, Erwin?

Indeed, regardless of how much you dislike the fact.

That is just pathetic of you.

I’ve told you what’s going to happen if you don’t start reigning in your ego and your misapprehension of your own level of knowledge, and right now your antics are demonstrating to all and sundry that I was correct. If you choose to ignore what I’m telling you, then don’t come crying to me when it does happen.